My view on the Patek 5123R

Jul 09, 2012,13:03 PM
 

The most impressive characteristic in Patek Philippe is without any doubt the high number of references that make up the catalogue for a brand whose production is estimated at 45,000 pieces per year. Take for example the 2 or 3 hands simple watches: Patek Philippe offers a wide range of proposals which is getting broader in 2012 with the unveiling of the 5123R.

By discovering the Calatrava 5123R, I didn't have the feeling to be in front of a novelty of this year. Because it is the main force of Patek Philippe: with constant reminders of the past, each new watch gives the impression of never having left the catalog. There is something extremely comforting in this approach that responds perfectly to the expectations of the clients who like to create links between today and yesterday references.





From an aesthetic point of view, the 5123R can be considered as a reinterpretation of the Calatrava 2526: Dauphine hands, the minutes track, the shape of the indexes,  they all bring back the purity of the dial of this famous reference. In the watchmaking world, it is very complicated to do it simple. Patek Philippe however doesn't have this kind of problem because its rich history is an inexhaustible source of inspiration and the 2526 constitutes the quintessence of the 3 hands watch.

At this stage, I know that some of you don't agree with me about the 2526 inspiration and that other reference like the 2573 due to the second hand display and even the case shape. But again, it is another asset for Patek Philippe: each of us can find the link with the past he wants to find.

The 2573:





Credit: Guille

The 2526:



Credit: Fabios

Back to the 5123R:







The silver opaline dial (and not an enamel one unfortunately as it was often the case for the 2526) has a deep elegance, the Dauphine hands tell the time with a very refined way over applied gold indexes which provide the necessary touch of volume. The second hand is very discrete, its sector being materialized by the crossing of two extremely fine perpendicular lines. This effect of style, while commonly seen in the past, is not harmless here and shows great skill from the Patek Philippe designers. This subtle sector tries to  hide dial side the main problem of the 5123R: the movement size which is too small. While this problem appears clearly on the 5196 which uses the same caliber, it tends to fade on the 5123R while the case of the latter is bigger (38 mm vs 37 mm for the 5196).





If the 2526 resemblance is quite obvious from the aesthetic point of view, it is  absolutely not the case from the mechanical point of view. The 5123R is a handwind watch in which we find the venerable and old 215PS. This movement is of course excellent, it has powered with efficiently many watches for several decades. I love its lay-out, the shape of its bridges and its performance is after all very acceptable. It features the Gyromax balance, a power reserve for 44 hours with a frequency of 4hz (which is quite unusual for this type of movement)  and all this, in a very contained size. If the thinness (2, 55 mm) is an asset in the context of a dressed watch, the 21.9 mm diameter is more problematic. To fully understand the difficulty to make the movement visible, you must realize that the 215PS is naturally found in 31 mm cases and Patek Philippe was even obliged to hide it with a solid caseback  in the context of the 5196 in order to avoid the view on the encircling ring.





All the Patek Philippe talent was to manage to create an opportunity from this concern: the movement is too small? Not a problem, we adapt the case! And so the 5123R uses with a rose gold case  with amazing curves which we have the pleasure to discover after the first glance. The diameter of the back is considerably reduced from the 38 mm (excluding crown) dial side. When the watch is turned over, the movement size is not anymore shocking. However, this unusual case shape may be surprising. The lugs as seen dial side seem to be very short while their actual size is far from being small.





When I put the watch on my wrist, these considerations were faded due to the charm of the dial is and the overall elegance which gives some power of seduction. I find it most convincing than the 5196. But I also believe that Patek Philippe has reached the end of the process with the 215PS. While the competition has been very active in renewing handwind movements (I'm thinking about Vacheron with the 4400 or  about Lange & Söhne with the L051.1 and L093.1  which are more adapted to the context of today cases), Patek Philippe still remains stuck with its 215PS. Time has come to find a worthy successor to this proud movement and to design new simple watches with will be balanced both dial and movement sides. The Patek Philippe prestige and power of attraction  are so out-of-competition that the Manufacture has to be very careful not to do it too easy. It is a feeling that cannot be excluded when we analyse this 5123R.





Many thanks to the Patek Philippe France team.

 


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Lovely review, thank you

 
 By: vitalsigns : July 9th, 2012-20:28
I very much like the watch; however, I remain uncertain about the abbreviated lugs. Cheers, John

Thanks John!

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:35
Lugs are a bit strange with this watch: they look small dial side and very long movement side. ;) fx

No. simple and clear like that

 
 By: COUNT DE MONET : July 9th, 2012-23:21
Have not seen it, but by using my experience with Pateks so far: it will be another unbalanced Patek. To put the 215 in a 38 mm case and trying to make the case look smaller by using a bizzare shape and short lugs does not work for me. The dial will be va... 

"Is not the question: why no more 36 mm is the actual question."

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 10th, 2012-10:22
because the people I know don't want these tiny watches anymore A dresswatch is prefered to be between 40 and 42 mm. Ofcourse I know some people still like or even prefer 35 or 36 mm but they are the minotity, just like only 10 or 15 % will prefer 46 and ... 

I cordially welcome your initiative!

 
 By: COUNT DE MONET : July 10th, 2012-10:38
And as we are doing a poll anyway: let us also measure the avarage wrist size. Believe me: this is a bow to the American taste, at the moment, suggested by marketing and consulting companies to Patek. I am sure Patek does this reluctantly. The Chinese hav... 

Size perception is influenced by so many parameters...

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:34
The bezel, the shape and length of the lugs, the dial colours, the indexes... you know some 36mm watches look as big as 38mm ones. Diameter is only one parameter. Thanks for your comments! Fx

I agree with the Count

 
 By: dr.kol : July 10th, 2012-13:45
but would also accept 35 mm. Best, Kari

You mean 5120 as a 35 mm piece: classicism at its best? I agree.

 
 By: COUNT DE MONET : July 10th, 2012-14:00
And it is even an auto with the caliber 240: what, honestly, what can a purist ask more for? The "entry level" Pateks are Pateks of and for the future as they are showing the past, the history and essence of watch making. Best Moritz

Indeed,

 
 By: dr.kol : July 10th, 2012-15:38
5120 was my 1st Patek and I'll not part from that. Best, Kari

Here you have some RESULTS

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 10th, 2012-23:49
Like said, via another forum because I can't make a poll on the purists. Linking is not appreciated so I just show you the results :-) [IMG]http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y145/unknown100/size.jpg[/IMG] ...  

I think this is pretty clear :-)

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 11th, 2012-00:19
It's about the average watch and a forum like the purists where you have several brands and not only Panerai LOL ( does TZ ring a bell ? :-) Anyway why do you think that Rolex makes bigger sportswatches and bigger datejusts and day-dates, sky-dweller. Eve... 

IMO, you absolutely cannot generalize.

 
 By: amanico : July 11th, 2012-00:31
A sportwatch is good around 40 / 42 mm. A toolwatch can be even bigger. A Grande Complicaton needs some place, so I would say somewhere between 42 and 44 mm. A dressy watch, time only, cannot be, in my eyes, big, it is antinomic.Less than 40 is much appre... 

And the small vintage watches have more and more success...

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 11th, 2012-01:17
because there were no bigger watches 30 - 50 years ago 35-36-37 was the standard size in 1950 - 1960 - 1970 I'll tell you more, but this is again my personal opinion ... if you could find vintage watches between 40 and 42 , these would be more popular the... 

Thank you!

 
 By: COUNT DE MONET : July 11th, 2012-02:32
I think I have seen this also, somewhere. Sure, a sports watch, casual, also let it be a complicated one ... why not 40+. BUT my reference is a classic watch. A Lange 1815 does not look the same in 40, or even a change of +1.7 mm in case of the 3940: the ... 

38 - 39 for me! nt

 
 By: Dje : July 10th, 2012-11:24
nt

Not sure Bruno.

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:33
First of all, it depends on the markets and with high end watches, you always have people interested in small cases. Look at the Simplicity 34mm... It is funny but when the quality is here, size is not a problem anymore. ;-) I'm still wearing my 36mm 1815... 

ofcourse

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 10th, 2012-11:51
ofcourse some people still like 34 mm watches but like said I'm pretty sure they are a minortiy Why do you think even rolex makes their watches bigger ? The Dufour is a superb watch but if he would give the possibility to order this watch in 34 or 40 mm I... 

AAah, the 215 PS in big cases...

 
 By: amanico : July 9th, 2012-23:30
This is and this is not a problem, from my point of view. This is a problem because if Patek wants to use such a small movement in their watches, they should, maybe, think about releasing a smaller case, around 34 / 35 mm. What? There will not be demand f... 

Thanks for your input.

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:31
If the 5196P is nice, it is also because it doesn't have the same dial than the other versions. And the gold versions display a very unbalanced dial IMHO. And yes I'm sure that they would have sold without any problem this 5123 with a smaller case. Fx

Even with 37 mm case and a saphire

 
 By: dr.kol : July 10th, 2012-13:47
case back 215 is not too bad. I am just playing with my 5134P and I have very little to complain. Best, Kari

Thank you for the review, the pictures are wonderful.

 
 By: whit : July 10th, 2012-08:24
But, I'm with the Count on this one. The case design does not appeal to me in the least. Case lugs, the bezel and the dish-like case back leave me cold. Maybe Patek should just re-introduce the 2526 instead of a new interpretation of a classic which frank... 

Thanks whit for your comments!

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:26
About the point you are underlining, I don't know if Patek would do it: it would be far from their strategy. They are the best to create iconic watches... by stopping them. ;) Fx

nice piece but the strap looks strange

 
 By: Bruno.M1 : July 10th, 2012-10:15
It is WAY too narrow. looks like a 16 mm strap for woman :-(

Yes it is true, I had this feeling first.

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:25
And after a few minutes I was used with it. It matches well the case shape IMHO. Fx

Thank you François-Xavier

 
 By: Dje : July 10th, 2012-11:29
Hi, I was pleasantly surprised to discover this new reference as I have very little appeal for modern Calatrava models (except for the 5196P or 5153G). I like this watch that looks like no other, is classical yet original. I like the special lugs and the ... 

Thanks Jérôme.

 
 By: foversta : July 10th, 2012-11:45
You are right, the strap contributes a lot to the special look. They always manage to create appealing details... Fx

Thanks bulliondesk! [nt]

 
 By: foversta : July 11th, 2012-13:55

Thanks for the review and great pictures.

 
 By: masterspiece : July 11th, 2012-00:47
As far as sizes go, personally, I do not care for 41 mm or larger pieces. So, I guess I would (probably) be one in the minority wherein I like the 33-35mm size. :-) Aloha, Bob

Thanks bob for your input.

 
 By: foversta : July 11th, 2012-13:57
Again, it is linked to the purpose of the watch. But you know, I can jump between a 42mm watch and a 36mm one... of course, the small watch looks... small the first days but it is ok after. I think that my brain needs time to get used with it. ;) Fx

Yes, I think I can jump to some larger sizes, too...

 
 By: masterspiece : July 12th, 2012-11:30
because there are some brands, Panerai in particular, that I like. I know that many people (the general populace) like larger watches and when looking at the fashion market, it's al about BIG. But they are for fashion and the general populace. I wonder if...